From: “Chris Ho-Stuart” <>
Newsgroups: aus.religion.christian
Subject: Re: Feigning evolution
> Gladys Swager wrote:
> > Chris,
> >
> > When God created man and woman He gave them the ability to procreate.
> > In that procreation every human is different from every other human.
> > It was a God-initiating process and a God-sustaining process.
> > Therefore, we can say that God made us. Humans have the choice to
> > continue that process or not.
>
Chris: So would you agree that an Almighty God can choose to use
> natural processes for my individual creation?
according to your gospel, ALL THINGS were made by Him.
> Without Him was not ANYTHING made that was made.
>
> This passage expresses the normal Christian view point, of a
> God who underlying all of creation, and works his purposes in
> all things.
>
> Christians who accept this principle are enabled to study the
> processes of the natural world, without considering that they
> are denying God’s involvement thereby.
>
G: Again, what consequences and evidences could be expected from the
> > creation of a fully-functioning world and universe?????
>
C: Simple. The absence of a long and detailed history of events
> extending for billions of years.
>
> If you are saying God could have created the APPEARANCE of age,
> so be it. Science works by the evidence; which shows great age,
> and long histories of many processes involved in the formation
> of this functioning world.
>
> Let me repeat some comments I made previously on this notion…
>
> An Almighty God could have set up all that evidence to look
> old when he formed the Earth last Tuesday, or last century,
> or two thousand years ago, or six thousand years ago. He
> could also have created a vast an ancient universe infused
> with the potential for life and complexity.
>
> The appearance of age, or the “Omphalos” argument, was proposed
> in 1857 by Phillip Gosse, a fundamentalist Christian who used
> the argument to defend his belief in a young earth from the
> overwhelming geological evidence that had accumulated even by
> then showing that it was old. The word “omphalos” means “navel”.
> It refers to the question of whether or not Adam had a navel.
>
> Gosse’s argument is that things were created with the appearance
> of age, showing the empirical signs of long history at the
> moment of formation; just like Adam was created with a navel.
>
> Actually, Gosse accepted that science does and should explore
> what is revealed by empirical evidence. He just considered that
> the history so revealed was in some sense “unreal”.
>
> The argument attracts much derision, and is widely seen as
> heretical by Christians. But for a fairly sympathetic review,
> by a Presbyterian minister and a member of the ASA, see here:
> <http://www.burgy.50megs.com/omphalos.htm>
>
> The ASA, by the way, is the American Scientific Affiliation,
> which describes itself as a fellowship of men and women in
> science and disciplines that relate to science who share
> a common fidelity to the Word of God and a commitment to
> integrity in the practice of science.
>
> They provide exactly the kind of helpful engagement with the
> concerns and confusions Christians have with science and the
> practice of science that I think is needed.
>
> Cheers — Chris